Clutch Bleeding Problems

[Gtstorey]

I worked on bleeding my brakes and clutch this weekend. I have one of the Motive Products pressure bleeders and the brakes went good, just a few minutes to do. The clutch however didn't do anything. This is on a combined reservoir and I checked that I was getting fluid to the master cylinder at the feed line, but nothing out of the M.C.
Pressing the pedal doesn't really feel like it's moving anything, other than pressing against a spring.

Any thoughts on what might be going on? Are there rebuild kits available?

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Clogged reservoir outlet or line pinch/kink? Are there any fluid leaks showing at the clutch master cylinder or transmission? Did you reuse the donor throw out bearing?
Sounds like lots of air and no fluid in the line between the clutch pedal and transmission if it has no hydraulic compression 'feedback'.

 

[Gtstorey]

I disconnected the line between the MC and the slave at the MC and no fluid. Is this possible a self sealing quick connect.

I also removed the slave cylinder bleeder completely and no drop in pressure on the gauge of the Motive bleeder. What ever the problem is has it sealed off tight.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Is there fluid in the clutch master cylinder? Remove the connection at the MC going out the the transmission, should drip out without pushing g on the clutch pedal. Don't believe the connections are self sealing.

 

[k.rollin]

Warning - Clutch Fluid Level

I thought the entire brake reservoir was a wide open container for the brakes and clutch. I was wrong. I noticed this while bleeding the clutch and before I knew it I was pumping air into the line and had to start all over with bleeding the clutch. While they share the same fluid, there is a...

dfkitcar.com

 

[Gtstorey]

If the outlet to the MC is not self sealing, then the Fluid is not making it through the MC. I am getting fluid to the MC from the reservoir, although it was dry when I first disconnected it. It was stopped up enough that a week of setting had not allowed the reservoir line to fill up by gravity.

I've ordered a new MC from Rockauto so we'll see if that fixes it. I think the piston may be stuck forward in the cylinder, not allowing fluid to enter or pass the seal.

 

[Gtstorey]

Warning - Clutch Fluid Level

I thought the entire brake reservoir was a wide open container for the brakes and clutch. I was wrong. I noticed this while bleeding the clutch and before I knew it I was pumping air into the line and had to start all over with bleeding the clutch. While they share the same fluid, there is a...

dfkitcar.com

I made sure the fluid was plenty high, it was almost completely full at one point as the pressure from the bleeder pushed fluid into the reservoir. I also should have lost pressure from the pump if it was a matter of the fluid level not being high enough. It held pressure for several minutes with the bleed fitting removed completely.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

If the outlet to the MC is not self sealing, then the Fluid is not making it through the MC. I am getting fluid to the MC from the reservoir, although it was dry when I first disconnected it. It was stopped up enough that a week of setting had not allowed the reservoir line to fill up by gravity.

I've ordered a new MC from Rockauto so we'll see if that fixes it. I think the piston may be stuck forward in the cylinder, not allowing fluid to enter or pass the seal.

Can you move the piston in MC by hand? If the piston is stuck forward maybe it separated from the actuator rod?

 

[Gtstorey]

Can you move the piston in MC by hand? If the piston is stuck forward maybe it separated from the actuator rod?

I haven't tried to pull it off yet. I wanted to ask on here to make sure I wasn't missing something obvious like a check valve or a self sealing connection before I pull it off and get brake fluid every where. I'll likely wait until I get the new one in before I pull it off so I can compare it.

 

[George]

try this

 

[Gtstorey]

try this

Yeah, I probably should have bled it before the transmission went in. I might have to try and rig up the motive bleeder to push fluid from the transmission end or buy a dedicated pressure bleeder for the downstream end.

 

[George]

See if you can reach through the hole where the line goes down and push the cylinder back.
Or hook a hose on the bleeder with cup to hold the fluid open the bleeder let it set for two hours.

Brad

 

[Gtstorey]

Clutch master cylinder problem was a stuck forward piston and the connecting rod had come loose from it. Of course the new cheap master cylinder that I bought leaked around the outlet port so I ended up with the old one reinstalled.

All of this has led me to a bigger problem. When I originally installed the clutch, I ordered a "M-Pact" brand clutch kit from Rockauto. I don't remember what the exact airgap was with the slave cylinder that came with the kit but I remember that it was slightly less than 0.15 with a ZZPerformance spacer (not sure if I realized they had two sizes at that time, so not sure whether I checked it with 0.20 or 0.25 spacer). I went with the "kit" slave instead of the GM slave that came with my new transmission since the compressed length was slightly taller. I didn't really think at the time, but that wasn't a good idea since the extended length was about the same. All of this leads to the slave blowing out while I was bleeding it.

I pulled the motor and transmission yesterday and the air gap with the GM slave is slightly above 0.50. This means that with a 0.25 spacer I'm still at an air gap of 0.25+.

What are most people getting for an air gap with a new clutch?
I had my flywheel turned, what are the chances that a new flywheel would help?
What are the chances that a gap of 0.25 will work?
Any thoughts on whether the ZZPerformance spacers can be stacked, although 2x 0.200 will put me on the tight side with a 0.1+ gap.
Follow up: ZZPerformance recommends just a single 0.25 spacer and thinks the 0.25 air gap will work.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[Gtstorey]

As a final follow up (hopefully) after a couple of more in and out of the transmission/motor it turns out I didn't have an overextended throw out bearing. It turned out that when I installed the old clutch elbow onto the new transmission (with the new clutch pipe) I ended up with two seals inside the elbow, which in turn allowed it to leak brake fluid into the transmission and eventually out the bottom onto the floor.

With the amount of fluid that was draining out, you would think that there would have been at least some fluid running down from the elbow onto the outside of the transmission, but not really. It was slightly damp with fluid but no more than you would expect from a normal bleeding process.