TheNuker
Goblin Guru
Thank you so very much @ctuinstra i owe you a beer next time your up here in KC!
What do you expect from a new engine! Haha
Nuker-
What do you expect from a new engine! Haha
Nuker-
Nukers City Goblin - 2009 SS/TC number 2 build
- Thread starter TheNuker
- Start date
ctuinstra
Goblin Guru
Same coil? I assume so. Try a new set of spark plugs. I've heard they are known to take out coils. I would have assumed only on the secondary side and not the primary side of the coil that you are getting, but it's worth a shot.
Also check to make sure the Black wire on that coil has a good path to ground. Ohm it out to ground. If it doesn't, it could be feeding through something else to ground causing damage.
SmsDetroit
Goblin Guru
Sounds like you have a pinched wire leading to that coil. I’d chase those wires back as far as you can
TheNuker
Goblin Guru
Okay another update after talking to Brad several times. We found out that all 4 of the coil packs use the same power and ground. So after eliminating that, we moved onto the wire that is different to each plug on the suspect plug this was the purple.
I traced this wire back to the ECU and cut it a couple inches away from the ECU and plugged another new coil pack into the 4th plug and put a new 15amp I fuse in. It now cranks and fires every time (I tested it 15 times) the fuse is good. Obviously the 4th coil pack is not working so it runs very rough. But this eliminates all of the other wires as the problem.
matter talking to Brad again it really appears to be a problem with the ECU with that pin something internal.
next step new ECU
thanks everyone,
Nuker-
edit: I also confirmed on my original engine harness that the purple in in question is in the same / right spot in both engine harnesses so it all points to the ECU.
I traced this wire back to the ECU and cut it a couple inches away from the ECU and plugged another new coil pack into the 4th plug and put a new 15amp I fuse in. It now cranks and fires every time (I tested it 15 times) the fuse is good. Obviously the 4th coil pack is not working so it runs very rough. But this eliminates all of the other wires as the problem.
matter talking to Brad again it really appears to be a problem with the ECU with that pin something internal.
next step new ECU
thanks everyone,
Nuker-
edit: I also confirmed on my original engine harness that the purple in in question is in the same / right spot in both engine harnesses so it all points to the ECU.
Briann1177
Goblin Guru
I'm willing to bet that there is nothing wrong with the ECM. While I don't have a good answer, here are a couple of thoughts. The purple wire has absolutely nothing to do with the INJ fuse. All the purple wire does is transmits the ECM signal to the coil pack to tell it to fire. It's a very low current circuit much like the control side of a relay. When you cut that wire, you basically "unplugged" the coil pack preventing it from firing. Granted, all of the other wires are still plugged in, but I don't think that matters. The only thing that will blow the INJ fuse is too much current through the pink/white wire coming from your fuse box. Why it only does that with coil 1 plugged in is the million dollar question.
Just out of curiosity, can you look at X1/D9 on your fuse box connector and tell me how many wires are in that position?
Just out of curiosity, can you look at X1/D9 on your fuse box connector and tell me how many wires are in that position?
ctuinstra
Goblin Guru
I'm in this camp. I wish I knew the inner working of the coil to and wish I knew exactly what was shorting in the coil to be able to determine how.
This is what is in the wiring diagram. The best that I can tell, the capacitor or the reversed diode is shorting. I still wonder about the BLK A wire. And I would surely try another spark plug just to be sure, I know it seems far fetched, but sometimes it's those things that will break you.
TheNuker
Goblin Guru
@ctuinstra
Okay I'll jump back on this tomorrow starting with a new spark plug for the hell of it. I see what you mean with the purple wire.
Would a good test be to switch a plug from one of the 3 that consistently work to the bad location and see if the problem follows?
I confirmed that the 4 wires are in the exact same locations in both the original harness I had from donor and the new harness including running to the same pin on the ECU plug. I'm running at a loss at what else to test after a plug, And I don't think these places are going to keep selling me coil pack to return LOL
Thanks guys,
Nuker-
Brian74
Goblin Guru
I can’t speculate because I’m not there, but nothing in the ECM signal supply circuit would cause a coil to blow a fuse. If ohmeter checks are good and engine/frame ground are good, I wouldn’t put it past multiple crap coils. Rare; but they do have bad manufacturing runs. Many of these parts are reboxed crap from the same company. I can set a calender for every 22.5 months that my Saturn VDO cooling fan will fail.
Have you tried swapping coil packs between cylinders yet? Also swap plug wires while you’re at it (if the wire will reach.)
We used to call it Sesame Street diagnostics “Which one of these is not like the other?”
Have you tried swapping coil packs between cylinders yet? Also swap plug wires while you’re at it (if the wire will reach.)
We used to call it Sesame Street diagnostics “Which one of these is not like the other?”
TheNuker
Goblin Guru
The date codes on the 2 denso are about 2 years apart, I would hope its not the same batch at least haha. I think I can switch the wires on the next coil over to the one having an issue. I really hate to keep blowing these 50$ coils though.
I have a totally different brand and the plastic looks different that i'll try tomorrow with the purple wire re-attached. After changing the sparkplug.
I guess I can start first putting my cheap off brand coilpack on the cylinder next to the problem and see what happens with the wire/plug from the problem cylinder. I guess if that does not blow it might be a bad spark plug, Which would be pretty crazy.
When I stuck pins in the ground on all 4 of the coilpack plugs in the wiring harness they had solid grounds to both the head and engine block. I also checked the hot side and I did not have any tone. So I don't think the hot side on the wiring side has any shorts to ground.
Another thing I noticed that I don't even have to try to fire the car to get the fuse/coilpack to blow, I just have to turn the key to the ready position where the fuel pump kicks on. That is enough to see the 15amp fuse flash and pop.
Thanks for everyones thoughts,
Nuker-
Brian74
Goblin Guru
I’ve been in the wiring diagrams a bit as of lately. What specific fuse keeps blowing?
ctuinstra
Goblin Guru
This one. It directly powers the all of the coil packs. What's sticking with me now is that he says that it' blows when the ignition is turned on and not even starting the engine.
ctuinstra
Goblin Guru
- Before you plug the purple wire in, measure the voltage on it from the ECM side. Also measure the voltage from one of the other coils (Dark Green/white, Light Blue, or Orange) and compare. Measure with just the ignition on, do not try to start yet.
- Swap coil packs with #2 and move the new one to the #2 position. #1 and #3 share the same low ref line, and #2 and #4 share their low ref line.
- Change all spark plugs just to eliminate that (long shot).
Give us a rundown of your wiring harness.
Was it all from a running donor or is it pieced together?
Has it been modified, maybe someone needed to supply power to a circuit and picked up power from the injector circuit which is causing an overload?
Are there different types of coil packs? Maybe the way the ECM commands the coil packs to fire is different from one year or another. (I think this is a stretch.)
Was it all from a running donor or is it pieced together?
Has it been modified, maybe someone needed to supply power to a circuit and picked up power from the injector circuit which is causing an overload?
Are there different types of coil packs? Maybe the way the ECM commands the coil packs to fire is different from one year or another. (I think this is a stretch.)
escapepilot
Goblin Guru
I’ve been following this trying to absorb knowledge for when my time comes and this fuse problem is a good puzzle. I don’t have a donor or wiring diagram, but I have a question that I hope helps. What does the INJ fuse power? Coil packs only doesn’t seem like the circuit would be named INJ. Only turning the ignition on without trying to start also doesn’t make sense for the fuse to blow. Are the injectors powered by that circuit or a fuel pump? They would get power with just key on. Maybe a short in that part of the circuit.