V1 Brian's City Goblin-06/Crate MotorTC #61

[JBINTX]

Brian is waiting for me to catch up to where he is at in his build.

Dang speed holes slowed you down……..

 

[Brian74]

Designed my LLC logo last night, using the same CAD program that I designed my dash & center console on. It was surprisingly easy. I plan to integrate it into my Goblin vinyl wrap design as a source of advertising.

 

[Rauq]

I remember reading a post back in the day on Reddit or imgur or somewhere picking apart a bunch of company's logos and pointing out design incongruities. I think you've done a lot better than some other folks who have entire design departments behind their logos. Looks good!

edit: I know I've seen this done for companies but I did find this similar breakdown for college sports logos
edit edit: this college logo breakdown is even better

 

[Brian74]

I remember reading a post back in the day on Reddit or imgur or somewhere picking apart a bunch of company's logos and pointing out design incongruities. I think you've done a lot better than some other folks who have entire design departments behind their logos. Looks good!

edit: I know I've seen this done for companies but I did find this similar breakdown for college sports logos
edit edit: this college logo breakdown is even better

Thanks; Cool article. Its kind of amazing how good of an eye people actually have for symmetry, which can be broken down between both the shape and positive/negative space. Quite often the simplest of designs work the best and are the most versatile.

 

[Brian74]

Finally, some holiday time off... I am transitioning to a supervisory position at work this next year, which much better aligns much with my skillset. Hopefully this will free up more time as well.

I’ve decided to commit more business time to furthering my CAD skills, as well as the purchase of 3 more 220 drops in the garage, a silent compressor, and a CNC plasma table. I want to provide a sensible and efficient way for the LLC to start becoming profitable while I continue to develop the scope of the business. 2-D design is SOO much simpler and less time-consuming. CNC plasma is also a great way to potentially mass produce some other well-designed custom Goblin parts; given the demand.

I will devote next week back to my Goblin... Mostly finishing the mockup and determining what else I need to plan for. Hopefully also finish some welding (floor supports and raised shoulder harness mounts) I’ve been putting off.

 

[Brian74]

Decided to try Fusion360 today. I need to become proficient at a professional CAD program if I plan to make money with this LLC. I was thinking it was gonna be super complicated.

I decided to start simple, using the sketch plane and a 2-D design, as this is going to be my bread and butter work once I get the CNC plasma table.

I basically just took my company logo that I designed 2 weeks ago on the otherCAD, and transferred all of the measurements over to the Fusion360 sketch application. Ended up being pretty intuitive and much easier than I thought.

Once I finished the 2D, I extruded it to 1”, added a .05” fillet to the face edges, and threw it in the rendering engine and turned into eye candy with a few different finishes & lighting samples.

Super stoked. I’m only 6 hours into the program and I’m really enjoying it. I don’t think it will be too much work to attain a profitable level of proficiency.

 

[Ark :D]

Are we sure this is still a Goblin build thread?

In all seriousness, CAD is awesome. Something I've been wanting to play with for quite a while, now.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

It is, especially when I start sending Brian some work that I will likely need to have done for some crazy ideas that Dale has thrown at me in the recent past. Custom Goblin work is just one of those things you gotta do!

 

[DCMoney]

Very nice! You're going to love dialing in the plasma, similar to dialing in the 3D printers but different. Design around the capabilities of plasma and you'll be fine. Our expectations for edge finish and hole quality was too high and it lead to lots of frustration. While I was able to improve the overall quality of the cut it was never enough for a few of the guys I worked with, which was one of the reasons we upgraded to a laser less than 2 years later.

What size plasma cutter you thinking of going with? When I bought a plasma table for work we started with a 85amp but within a month swapped it out with a 105amp hypertherm. We had too many runs hitting the duty cycle of the cutter. Which ever plasma you go with check out the price of the consumables, as soon as quality would start to drop we would change out the consumables and quality would go back to normal. The nozzles were the main consumable that was changed out the most.

I assume you'll do a water table? We went with a downdraft mainly so we could cut aluminum on the table as well. I do not recommend going with an open setup, unless you completely seal off the table from the rest of your shop and put good air filtration in.

You going to get an air dryer for your new compressor?

 

[Brian74]

Very nice! You're going to love dialing in the plasma, similar to dialing in the 3D printers but different. Design around the capabilities of plasma and you'll be fine. Our expectations for edge finish and hole quality was too high and it lead to lots of frustration. While I was able to improve the overall quality of the cut it was never enough for a few of the guys I worked with, which was one of the reasons we upgraded to a laser less than 2 years later.

What size plasma cutter you thinking of going with? When I bought a plasma table for work we started with a 85amp but within a month swapped it out with a 105amp hypertherm. We had too many runs hitting the duty cycle of the cutter. Which ever plasma you go with check out the price of the consumables, as soon as quality would start to drop we would change out the consumables and quality would go back to normal. The nozzles were the main consumable that was changed out the most.

I assume you'll do a water table? We went with a downdraft mainly so we could cut aluminum on the table as well. I do not recommend going with an open setup, unless you completely seal off the table from the rest of your shop and put good air filtration in.

You going to get an air dryer for your new compressor?

I’m looking at the Langmuir tables with water as they offer a very reputable product in a smaller form factor. Probably going with a Primeweld Cut60. I’m not planning on running it all day or for big production runs. As it sits if I either sell the sandrail or relocate it across the shop, I can run the plasma table right against an open garage door. I was debating on some industrial curtains with a reasonable standoff to isolate the area slightly. not quite sure yet.

With the air as dry as it usually is here, moisture is not a huge problem from what others have told me but a 1 micron quality filter with a water trap should suffice.

Still have a bit more research to do before pulling the trigger.

 

[DCMoney]

Highly recommend at least a water table to cut down on the dust. Its worse than you can imagine. Operator forgot to turn on the downdraft fan a few times and it would fill our huge shop with dust and smoke in a matter seconds. After the 4th time I wired the fan to come one with a relay that was trigger when the machine was set to run a job.

Figured you wouldn't be running all day, just be aware of the duty cycles for whichever plasma unit you buy. For example on the hypertherm 85, duty cycle was 60% or 6 minutes at 85 amps at 104 degrees, but that was at 3 phase 400v. So while 85amps was enough to cut absolutely everything we needed, the 105amp unit provided a duty cycle much higher especially at 45amps for majority of what we cut (3/16" steel and thinner).

Not having a dryer would be nice.

 

[Brian74]

Highly recommend at least a water table to cut down on the dust. Its worse than you can imagine. Operator forgot to turn on the downdraft fan a few times and it would fill our huge shop with dust and smoke in a matter seconds. After the 4th time I wired the fan to come one with a relay that was trigger when the machine was set to run a job.

Figured you wouldn't be running all day, just be aware of the duty cycles for whichever plasma unit you buy. For example on the hypertherm 85, duty cycle was 60% or 6 minutes at 85 amps at 104 degrees, but that was at 3 phase 400v. So while 85amps was enough to cut absolutely everything we needed, the 105amp unit provided a duty cycle much higher especially at 45amps for majority of what we cut (3/16" steel and thinner).

Not having a dryer would be nice.

I’m thinking I’m going to focus most of my customer work for now on cutting jobs on one-off projects ranging from 20-16 gauge steel. I am proficient in 2-D design and I enjoy it, so I figure that will require the least amount of overhead. I also see doing production runs of smaller parts using 1/4” steel. If I could just go laser, I would in a **** heartbeat. I just don’t see the feasibility of going into debt at this point. I still have other tooling I need that I have yet to purchase.

I still work full time in a very busy and completely unrelated profession. My goal of customer jobs for the next 5 years is merely to offset the cost of tooling. This business is purely a weekend/spare time gig for me right now (although for the time being I’m refocusing on finishing my Goblin build.)

I started looking at the posts from the other langmuir owners. They have come up with some pretty creative ways of applying various air/particulate removal techniques.

I’ll get back to posting about my build. Last time I left off, I was in the middle of designing a linear variable actuated front spoiler using simple flat plane drag coefficient to increase front downforce.

 

[Brian74]

I got started on the template for my front splitter/spoiler. I scaled up my CAD design, and instead of printing up a huge template, I went old school; I threw it in a projector and traced it out.

I wanted to keep it simple as all I really need it to do is disrupt some of the fwd laminar airflow to create downforce. I will run lightweight sheet below the cowling as well as a rear diffuser and side splitters in an attempt to keep the airflow below the car as undisturbed as possible.

I’m prototyping this out for a general idea of fitment and to determine mounting. I think the front will mount on a bearing pivot, with adjustable turnbuckles on each end to provide a small degree of adjustment. The front spoiler will be made from 1/4” aluminum plate and weight 10 to 15 lbs.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

CADboard to the rescue! It's amazing how many of the best ideas applied to the Goblin start out as a cardboard box!

 

[Rttoys]

I would try to adapt SACTX splitter design with your wing design. It would cover the bottom and add more aero. It’s something we have both talked about, but haven’t implemented due to the satisfactory results of the splitter. More downforce Would be better, but it’s good the way it sits, so it’s a back burner project for us.

 

[Classy]

A few things on the front splitter, first, 1/4” solid aluminum is way too much. Splitters in the racing world at least are considered a consumable. Meaning if you run one, expect that it can be damaged or ripped off. Continuing on that you would rather the splitter give on an impact rather than break the bolts or mounting loose. I would go with 1/8” aluminum or aluminite.
Second, the angle you show in the pictures is a heavy angle and yes would increase down force, but will also create a lot of drag. I like that you are planning on making it adjustable but it should be generally flat. To that point, the one that RRtoys is using bolts under the car and can still be adjusted via washers/spacers if another angle is wanted.
The last thing, in the event there is an impact, your design will put it into the body work and potentially into the radiator.
I wrote all this in the best of intentions and I do want to be helpful.

I bought a splitter for my Miata on Black Friday and it is sitting in my garage, I am almost afraid to use it because I have seen what happens in the event of a hard impact.

 

[Brian74]

I

A few things on the front splitter, first, 1/4” solid aluminum is way too much. Splitters in the racing world at least are considered a consumable. Meaning if you run one, expect that it can be damaged or ripped off. Continuing on that you would rather the splitter give on an impact rather than break the bolts or mounting loose. I would go with 1/8” aluminum or aluminite.
Second, the angle you show in the pictures is a heavy angle and yes would increase down force, but will also create a lot of drag. I like that you are planning on making it adjustable but it should be generally flat. To that point, the one that RRtoys is using bolts under the car and can still be adjusted via washers/spacers if another angle is wanted.
The last thing, in the event there is an impact, your design will put it into the body work and potentially into the radiator.
I wrote all this in the best of intentions and I do want to be helpful.

I bought a splitter for my Miata on Black Friday and it is sitting in my garage, I am almost afraid to use it because I have seen what happens in the event of a hard impact.

I have been researching splitter design for quite some time. I do understand its purpose and also the point of it being consumable. Even without the splitter, any impact on the front of this car is not going to be favorable whatsoever. This is part of the reason that DF redesigned the replaceable front radiator mounting clip back around frame #60. I also do not plan on road racing this car.

A degree of rigidity is required or added mounting support is required. I thought about 1/8” but quickly decided not to, as the shape would lead to excessive flex and thus cracking in very short time. I do not want to create any additional lack of front ground clearance either.

The way I have it mounted on the mockup is not the final angle or shape. More cutting will be required on the template to adjust to flatter angle to prevent cowling interference. I’m going slow and removing a bit at a time.

Honestly I kind of laugh when people start to talk about drag considerations and the Goblin. This car has the inherent drag of a riding lawnmower. Its probably the last car a person should buy who is concerned with high speed aerodynamic efficiency.

 

[Brian74]

I would try to adapt SACTX splitter design with your wing design. It would cover the bottom and add more aero. It’s something we have both talked about, but haven’t implemented due to the satisfactory results of the splitter. More downforce Would be better, but it’s good the way it sits, so it’s a back burner project for us. View attachment 29685View attachment 29687

I read through his posts. I really like how he extended the flat zone along the entire car as well as the side splitters.

 

[Rauq]

Did you ever decide if you'd be willing to share the STls for your side panel mounting brackets?

 

[Brian74]

Did you ever decide if you'd be willing to share the STls for your side panel mounting brackets?

Yes. I just have not gotten around to finalizing the proper offsets and mounting them yet. Been busy with this front spoiler.