No Key - Lost Key

[DanPerryy]

Lonny and Adam had a couple of steering column ignition switches without keys. You can buy uncut keys from multiple places. The car can be programmed to accept the code in a key - but what about getting the key to mechanically turn the ignition?

There are 3 different types of cylinders. The one shown in the pictures is called the "first design".

In looking through the service manual there is a description of how to remove the tumbler from the lock. The tumbler has a code on it that I imagine to be the mechanical key code.

To remove the tumbler I put a blank key in the switch and turned the key to run (up against the start spring). Then I put a pick into the hole in the switch casing nearest the key and pressed it down. There is a spring pawl on the tumbler itself that you are pressing down. The tumbler then pops right out.

After reading the instructions on how to key a cylinder the new cylinder is keyed with a final step of crimping some clips - essentially having to buy a new cylinder.

If you would just like to get your car running with a lost key you can grind off the little bar on the side of the tumbler cylinder essentially making any key work mechanically (even a screwdriver). The car will not start unless you program the key.

Sorry Lonny and Adam, you now have a universal steering column lock!!!

 

[BAR-AIR]

Good Evening,
Looking for some information. I have "Blue" up in Buffalo pretty much buttoned up. Finished the electrical up with the exception of the lights and the control panel for the steering wheel switches (Adam & Lonny are ordering lights, mirrors and are reworking the switch panel). Engine and transmission complete. Radiator hoses in with the exception of the surge tank need to re tap for 3/4" barbed fitting. Still working on mount for the superchargers cooler so can not start engine at this time.
Here is where I'm having some issues.... I dropped the battery in the Goblin to power it up. Dash, idiot lights, mileage, temp, low fuel, low brake fluid and ambient light sensors all work. Turn key to turn over the engine basically nothing! I get a click in the starter relay (on the BCM) and a click in the main fuse block, the dash back lighting stays the same but the idiot lights and the mileage and temp read outs go out (black). I didn't have much time but re cleaned all the grounds and checked for power at starter and fuse block (yes for both). I'm on the road until Monday trying to plan my systematic approach to fix this (yeh I know it could be anything from I missed a wire in the harness to the donor's car security system to a bad starter (actually the only thing that I didn't rebuild).
Another thing has anyone disabled the steering wheel lock and key lock on the ignition? I still have to press them on the ignition switch to turn the key or to get the key out.
THX, Bruce

 

[JSATX]

Good Evening,
Looking for some information. I have "Blue" up in Buffalo pretty much buttoned up. Finished the electrical up with the exception of the lights and the control panel for the steering wheel switches (Adam & Lonny are ordering lights, mirrors and are reworking the switch panel). Engine and transmission complete. Radiator hoses in with the exception of the surge tank need to re tap for 3/4" barbed fitting. Still working on mount for the superchargers cooler so can not start engine at this time.
Here is where I'm having some issues.... I dropped the battery in the Goblin to power it up. Dash, idiot lights, mileage, temp, low fuel, low brake fluid and ambient light sensors all work. Turn key to turn over the engine basically nothing! I get a click in the starter relay (on the BCM) and a click in the main fuse block, the dash back lighting stays the same but the idiot lights and the mileage and temp read outs go out (black). I didn't have much time but re cleaned all the grounds and checked for power at starter and fuse block (yes for both). I'm on the road until Monday trying to plan my systematic approach to fix this (yeh I know it could be anything from I missed a wire in the harness to the donor's car security system to a bad starter (actually the only thing that I didn't rebuild).
Another thing has anyone disabled the steering wheel lock and key lock on the ignition? I still have to press them on the ignition switch to turn the key or to get the key out.
THX, Bruce

Bruce, kind of a long shot but did you see this post by Alex?

"The motor now starts with the key and stays running! Thanks again to Adam for pointing out the CANBUS wires that needed to be looped back together after somebody removed the OnStar "VCIM" module from the rear deck."

I made a mental note of this maybe it helps?

 

[Lonny]

Do you have the shifter wires hooked up. When you put it in park the key should release properly and that would explain why it does not turn over.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Yes the shifter wires are connected and it is in park. (The shifter itself is not connected to the frame or the shifter cable) also made sure the transmission was in the parked position. It seems like more of a power draw when trying to turn over. The way the idiot lights blank out.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Still looking for some more information. Quick update.... still not able to start... replaced starter today not the problem old one bench tested fine. Pick up a relay bypass switch (kind of cool pull any of your relays out of the fuse block then plug this in and you have an ON/OFF switch). So with the bypass switch I can turn the engine over, run the fuel pump, run the radiator fan. But I can do nothing but get the dash to light up with the key. I am getting a security icon light in the dash but it does go out after a few seconds? Ideas???

 

[Adam]

It is strange that you have to manually unlock the ignition switch to remove the key. That should happen automatically when the gear selector is in park and the button is released. Is there any chance the custom shifter knob you've got isn't letting the button come up enough to trigger the limit switch on the passenger side of the shifter?

If the switch is being triggered properly, check the black wire that goes to the car to see if it is grounded.

When you turn the key to the run position, you should hear the fuel pump and the throttle come to life. Since the fuel pump comes on when you jump it but not with the key in run position, I don't think it is a power draw problem. It is normal for the dash display lights to go out while cranking.

One thing we tested that gave similar symptoms (except that the throttle pedal still worked) was to move the shift arm on the transmission out of park. When not in park, the fuel pump did not come on when I turned the key and the engine wouldn't turn over. Park is the furthest back position (toward you if you stand behind the car).

We are going to keep thinking of what could be going on. If you find any more symptoms, let us know.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Well getting closer... The new shifter knob didn't let the shifter button go up high enough to trigger the park switch. So key works as it should. But still no start.... again I can run everything remotely (fuel,starter,butterfly etc....) just not getting anything with the key. Other then dash lights...

 

[Lonny]

Send us an image of which lights are on when the key is in the run position and another while the key is held in the start position.
We will try to recreate it here.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Initial key two clicks to the right (these are the indicators for about 3 seconds).

After about 3 seconds these are the remaining indications

This is with the key held in the start position.

 

[Lonny]

Did your donor have ABS brakes ?

 

[BAR-AIR]

Yes

 

[Lonny]

Several components of a Cobalt need to be able to share information with each other and also allow a tech to interface with these components.

GM daisy chained a data wire in and out of many components on a Cobalt. On a Goblin it starts with the OBDII and then continues to the power steering, BCM, ECM and TCM.

Though not necessarily in that order.

Some of the components we remove may break the chain such as the onstar, ABS brakes and air bags.


The pair of wires will always be twisted and usually one solid tan and one tan with a black stripe. Sometimes they may be brown and brown with a white stripe like the ones going in and back out of the power steering.

To check for continuity you will need a multimeter.
Set your multimeter on continuity test.

If your on the correct setting when you touch the two leads together you should hear a beep.

Disconnect the ground terminal on your battery.

Now with some help find the solid tan data wire on the back oh the OBDII plug and touch one of the probes in contact with the wire and hold it.

Now find the solid tan wire inside of the TCM plug and make contact with it with the other multimeter lead. It should beep indicating continuity.

Do this for ECM, BCM and the power steering making note of any that don't beep.
Some of the components have to be plugged up two allow data to continue on, like the power steering. It has to be pluged up for data to continue to the next system.
You need to do this test for the tan wire with a black stripe also.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Good Evening,
Finally had time to run that continuity test it was wired correctly. Still no start.... installed the second set of computers from another 2008 with automatic and then was showing security codes "ENG PWR REDUCED" & "ENGINE DISABLED ". Butterfly moves with gas pedal but no fuel pump. I'm not sure if you can swap the computers from car to car even if they are the same year. Or if I need to swap the ignition switch also?

 

[BAR-AIR]

Continuation of previous post. Changed the ignition switch with the ignition switch from the second donor (computers swapped into "BLUE"). Turns over as it should. But I am popping the 15 amp fuel pump fuse as soon as power is connected.

 

[BAR-AIR]

Chafed wire going to the fuel pump arcing it out. Engine started on second set of computers and matching ignition switch. (Just started and shut down don't have the pump wired for the supercharger yet). Any ideas why the first set of computers and ignition did not work?

 

[Adam]

Chafed wire going to the fuel pump arcing it out. Engine started on second set of computers and matching ignition switch. (Just started and shut down don't have the pump wired for the supercharger yet). Any ideas why the first set of computers and ignition did not work?

That's good to hear but I'm not sure why the first set of computers did not work. If you can get a scan tool maybe the first computer can provide some codes to help figure it out.

 

[DanPerryy]

When I first tried to start mine, the fuel pump came on, the butterfly operated, it cranked, started, backfired through the butterfly and died. Then trying to re-start the butterfly would not open and it indicated reduced power. Reset with a scan tool (elm327 and a android notepad with torque master software) and tried again. Same situation. I checked the fuel rail and it was not full. Purged it (jumping the fuel pump as it would not pump very long), reset the codes and tried to restart - success. The reason I mention this is that the reduced power mode get sets into the ECM and it is a bit of a pain to get it cleared.