Replacing the Timing Kit, Balance Shaft Kit and Water Pump

[JeffsGoblin]

While I had the engine out and stripped I figured it was a good time to replace these parts. If anyone wants to do this, here are the notes from my “never done before venture”:

Order the following:

• Cloyes 9-4201S Multi-Piece Timing Kit
• Cloyes 9-4202S Balance Shaft Kit
• For SC/TC cars the large sprocket that comes with this kit will not work. You can reuse the old one or purchase GM part number 12642713 (which I did)
• Dorman 917-954 Timing Chain Guide Bolt (if you don’t already have one)
• ACDelco 252-821 Professional Water Pump
• You can use the old water pump sprocket or purchase a new one (I purchased a new one)
• Mahle Original CS54440 Engine Conversion Gasket Set; cheaper than going with individual gasket purchases and more convenient
• Magnetic Oil Drain Plug (if you don’t already have one)
• Loctite 515 Flange Sealant
• Harmonic Balancer (purchase new or use the old one); my car had 118K miles on it, so I purchased a new one
• Harmonic Balancer Bolt (must purchase a new one if you plan on using your old harmonic balancer, at least that is what the manual says) GM part number 11589123

“Special” tools you will need (I had none of the following tools on hand. What can I say, I’m a computer geek not an auto mechanic):

• Rent a pulley puller kit from your local Advance Auto or AutoZone. This is for removing the Harmonic Balancer
• 1¼ inch or 32mm wrench or socket to remove/install the primary tensioner
• 15/16 or 24mm open ended wrench to hold the camshaft in place while you loosen or tighten the camshaft sprockets/phasers
• 10mm hex drive to remove the bolt access plug which will be replaced by the Dorman 917-954 Timing Chain Guide Bolt if your engine doesn’t already have one of these
• Torque Wrench

Watched the following video from Cloyes for installation instructions:

 

[JERMzSS]

While I had the engine out and stripped I figured it was a good time to replace these parts. If anyone wants to do this, here are the notes from my “never done before venture”:

Order the following:

• Cloyes 9-4201S Multi-Piece Timing Kit
• Cloyes 9-4202S Balance Shaft Kit
• For SC/TC cars the large sprocket that comes with this kit will not work. You can reuse the old one or purchase GM part number 12642713 (which I did)
• Dorman 917-954 Timing Chain Guide Bolt (if you don’t already have one)
• ACDelco 252-821 Professional Water Pump
• You can use the old water pump sprocket or purchase a new one (I purchased a new one)
• Mahle Original CS54440 Engine Conversion Gasket Set; cheaper than going with individual gasket purchases and more convenient
• Magnetic Oil Drain Plug (if you don’t already have one)
• Loctite 515 Flange Sealant
• Harmonic Balancer (purchase new or use the old one); my car had 118K miles on it, so I purchased a new one
• Harmonic Balancer Bolt (must purchase a new one if you plan on using your old harmonic balancer, at least that is what the manual says) GM part number 11589123

“Special” tools you will need (I had none of the following tools on hand. What can I say, I’m a computer geek not an auto mechanic):

• Rent a pulley puller kit from your local Advance Auto or AutoZone. This is for removing the Harmonic Balancer
• 1¼ inch or 32mm wrench or socket to remove/install the primary tensioner
• 15/16 or 24mm open ended wrench to hold the camshaft in place while you loosen or tighten the camshaft sprockets/phasers
• 10mm hex drive to remove the bolt access plug which will be replaced by the Dorman 917-954 Timing Chain Guide Bolt if your engine doesn’t already have one of these
• Torque Wrench

Watched the following video from Cloyes for installation instructions:

Good info! I know Cody from that video. Cool dude and a hell of a driver.

 

[ncgoblin]

I am doing some research regarding timing chain interval change and most posts are saying it does not require changing for the life of the engine. I understand parts wear over time but am wondering at what rate do these parts wear. I have also read the tensioner is a problem. What minimum parts would one want to replace?

 

[JeffsGoblin]

The two things I would definitely replace would be 1. the tensioner, which is the large 1-1/4 inch bolt on the exhaust side of the engine and 2. the top guide holding bolt, which is this guy:

https://www.dormanproducts.com/p-86802-917-954.aspx?year=2007&make=Chevrolet&model=Cobalt&parttype=Engine%20Timing%20Chain%20Guide%20Bolt

The plastic guides may have wear and need replaced. Unfortunately, you really don't know if anything needs replaced without inspecting them and that means taking the timing cover off.

 

[Karter2026]

Once you are in there. Change it all. I know it says "life of engine" Determine that statement..... every engine is different. I have seen 10k life and 300k life from the same engine. Changing everything is cheap insurance. It is not that hard of a job.

 

[ctuinstra]

I personally seen the life of one engine to be 176K when it's chain let go. The biggest factor is that tensioner, GM had issues with it and went through several versions before finally settling on the latest. Do the research on the most current version on the tensioner and swap that out at the least.

 

[ncgoblin]

I bit the bullet and just ordered the entire list the main reason is I finally figured out that I had a fuel pressure issue and replaced the fuel pump now I am stable at about 57psi went to go for a ride yesterday and hear a raddle noise near the timing cover. This may be linked to low oil in the head or bad tensioner. I am going to run a flush, replace the timing chain parts, and then test again.

I act bummed around the wife but secretly enjoy fixing these problems

 

[Lonny]

What does a flush consist of?

 

[ncgoblin]

What does a flush consist of?

One of my coworkers thought there could be a chance of a clogged channel between the block and the head and recommended running this additive then flushing.
BestLine 853796001049 Premium Synthetic Engine Treatment for Gasoline Engines - 16 oz. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0093XZDS4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_yBZ7CbT27ZS2T

I typically never fall for additives but I was willing to give it a shot for $17.

After removing the valve cover tonight I notice some slack in the chain at the 2 sprockets. I believe I have a faulty tensioner. Normally I would just change this part since it’s an easy swap but so is removing the side cover and replacing all components.

 

[ncgoblin]

Ok so I am at a loss and could use some advice. I ordered both coyles timing chain kits which includes sprockets, both chains, and tensioner. I installed everything and the car started right up. About 30 seconds later I hear the timing chain rattle I even purchased a stethoscope to make sure I am hearing it in the right spot. Keep in mind prior to ordering this kit I heard a similar sound. I took everything off and reinstalled just in case I missed something the first time like activating the tensioner with a long screwdriver I pushed decently this time just in case. Turn on car and same sound. I then refunded the kit and bought another off Amazon thinking maybe I had a defected tensioner. I installed for the 3rd time and again pushed on the upper guide to activate tensioner. Drove it around the block thinking maybe I needed to build some pressure brought it home turned it off. The next day car would not start. I then removed valve cover and could push down on the chain from the top with a decent amount of slack.

These are the (2) kids I purchased:

• Cloyes 9-4201S Multi-Piece Timing Kit
• Cloyes 9-4202S Balance Shaft Kit

Am I losing oil pressure? I inspected the lower jet and its not clogged but what other jets should I be inspecting? Am I not pushing hard enough on activating the tensioner?

I did buy an oil pressure gauge hoping maybe it would tell me something.

Thanks

 

[ctuinstra]

Are you absolutely sure you have correctly activated the timing chain tensioner? The first time I did it I thought I did it correctly and then checked and it wasn't, then did it again and managed to activate it the second time. It's been so long now I don't remember exactly how I did it. I really sounds like then tensioner is not applying tension. Either that or there is something else majorliy wrong such as a bearing.

 

[ncgoblin]

Are you absolutely sure you have correctly activated the timing chain tensioner? The first time I did it I thought I did it correctly and then checked and it wasn't, then did it again and managed to activate it the second time. It's been so long now I don't remember exactly how I did it. I really sounds like then tensioner is not applying tension. Either that or there is something else majorliy wrong such as a bearing.

When I removed the tensioner it released pressure off cams and i had to disassemble to deactivate.

 

[ctuinstra]

When you removed the tensioner the second and third time, was it under spring tension?

 

[JeffsGoblin]

What large sprocket did you use in the picture below? The one with the Cloyes kit will not work and you can see they are different. You can only use GM part number 12642713...

 

[ctuinstra]

I don't remember the large one being different. I thought the two smaller balance shaft sprockets were the wrong ones because I kept them for a long time until I knew the engine was running fine and the finally tossed them. It may be differences in kits/engines.

 

[JeffsGoblin]

Chad, from my research, the large sprocket (right) is specifically for forced induction engines and you have to use the original or buy a new GM part number per the Cloyes video. The sprocket on the left is for NA engines and came with the Cloyes kit and will not work. The smaller balance shaft gears from the Cloyes kit should work just fine.

 

[ncgoblin]

What large sprocket did you use in the picture below? The one with the Cloyes kit will not work and you can see they are different. You can only use GM part number 12642713...
View attachment 9247

The large one I reused per their guide I did remove the clip and reinstall.

I did not reuse smaller intake/exhaust sprockets.

The tensioner reacted the same I believe each time I removed. When I install the upper exhaust cam sprocket I do have to move it which has a bit of tension in order for the groves to line up with the cam not sure if that makes any difference I also verified all marks on chains were correct.

 

[JeffsGoblin]

Is the upper chain guide bolt installed correctly and holds the black plastic chain guide firmly?

 

[ncgoblin]

Is the upper chain guide bolt installed correctly and holds the black plastic chain guide firmly?
View attachment 9251

I can double check I purchased the new all in one bolt so I’m sure it’s tight.

 

[ctuinstra]

Chad, from my research, the large sprocket (right) is specifically for forced induction engines and you have to use the original or buy a new GM part number per the Cloyes video. The sprocket on the left is for NA engines and came with the Cloyes kit and will not work. The smaller balance shaft gears from the Cloyes kit

I'm sure you are correct. I got you and the thread op mixed up and thought you were asking me. And truthfully I don't remember what I did that far back because it was fairly uneventful.