V1 Josh's City Goblin - 10 XFE Donor

[Gtstorey]

Required torque is partially a function of the fastener material. Maybe the lube instead of loctite might be a problem but I wouldn’t really expect it to show up that quickly.
Maybe an inaccurate torque wrench?

 

[Robinjo]

Isn’t there different torque steps for ARP studs over the stock items anyways? For Honda units I know there was a torque and release and retorque procedure.

 

[jirwin]

Required torque is partially a function of the fastener material. Maybe the lube instead of loctite might be a problem but I wouldn’t really expect it to show up that quickly.
Maybe an inaccurate torque wrench?

How would I even verify an inaccurate torque wrench. I sure as hell hope its accurate cuz I used it for the whole motor

 

[Gtstorey]

Checking it to another torque wrench. Might also possible using weight x distance to check that it’s in the ball park. How old is it?

 

[jirwin]

Checking it to another torque wrench. Might also possible using weight x distance to check that it’s in the ball park. How old is it?

New Tekton from when I started the Goblin build

 

[Dsteinhorst]

Well now I feel slightly more bad about abusing the hell out of my stock LAP internals on 13psi , I'm running the same engine as you with the exception of cams, springs, balance shafts and injectors, I regularly turn it to 8100 RPM and have never had the head off. . .

Boy, what Josh and I have done to our LAPs is tame compared to that!

 

[Joebob]

Read over the GM Ecotec Build Book again and noticed that they say to torque the studs to 8ft lbs with blue Loctite. I used ARP lube, and my studs were already torqued twice, so I'm sure they were over 8ft lbs. I also noticed they say 85ft lb for the nuts, whereas I did 80ft lbs (per ZZP). Maybe those two things would make the difference

Did you use that lube in the torqueing of the nuts? I could make a big difference.

Joe

 

[jirwin]

Did you use that lube in the torqueing of the nuts? I could make a big difference.

Joe

Yes, ARP lube for both ends of the studs

 

[SmsDetroit]

If you had the head off twice and used the same head gasket I’d bet that is your problem. I’ve always be one and done with them. Unless they specifically say they can be reused, they are one time use only.

 

[jirwin]

If you had the head off twice and used the same head gasket I’d bet that is your problem. I’ve always be one and done with them. Unless they specifically say they can be reused, they are one time use only.

To be clear it wasn't heat cycled, it was just when I was building the engine outside of the car. It was new as of then. Still could be the issue, and I don't plan on doing it again

 

[Robinjo]

Gladly. Top side of 2-3 is the only visible "damage"

That doesn't look too bad. From the original (far away) picture I was expecting more coating peeling. It still could be the issue but I'm less inclined to think that now.

 

[jirwin]

Yeah I'm pretty stumped. Taking the head over to a local shop today to get the head checked just in case. Then I'm just gunna slap the head back on with a new gasket and see what happens.

 

[jirwin]

Warped head 6 thou between 1&2, 2&3, 3&4. Head was already decked 5 thou. Guy says he would probably have to deck it another 10 thou. No idea if the valves will clear then. I was worried about that a lot with the flat top pistons I had when I did the initial build. Taking even more off scares me. Not sure what I'm going to do yet. Sourcing a new 2.2 head is cheap, but getting it done up is expensive.

 

[Gtstorey]

Are there different head gasket thicknesses available for the 2.2? Probably not?

 

[jirwin]

It uses an LE5 (2.4) head gasket actually since its basically the LE5 head on the L61 bottom end. I was running the thickest Cosmetic I could previously at 0.060. Stock is 0.025. I had a total of 11.5 thou taken off head and block combined.

 

[Gtstorey]

There are different thicknesses available but I guess it depends on what you used originally.
Cometic 4-Cylinder Chevy Cylinder Head Gaskets - JEGS

 

[jirwin]

After having some time to think it over.... I think decking (up to) 10 thou is probably worth the risk.

Some background. I found out during this build that the stock LAP pistons are domed with valve pockets. My Wisecos are flat top, but should equate to the same 10:1 compression. I was worried about it because I figured the valve pockets are there for a reason. So, I went with the thickest Cometic (0.060") that I could get and sent it.

Some math...
Stock head gasket: 0.025"
My Cometic: 0.060"
My head and block deck, combined: -0.0115"

That should still net me +0.0235" over stock as is. If the machine shop has to take another 0.010", I'm still +0.0135".

If we assume I'm fine without having valve reliefs, then this is probably the way to go.

 

[Gtstorey]

Buy 2 head gaskets. Check the Valero piston clearance. If it isn’t enough, flycut the pistons or replace the pistons. Don’t just send it.

 

[jirwin]

Buy 2 head gaskets. Check the Valero piston clearance. If it isn’t enough, flycut the pistons or replace the pistons. Don’t just send it.

I do have a tool to cut valve reliefs in the pistons, but I'm afraid to take material out (strength wise).

I will use the old gasket to check clearance, but you have to remember, its VVT. Clearance can change. Very difficult to test

 

[Gtstorey]

If I couldn’t find a way to check valve clearance, I’d lock the cams in position. There is probably enough info available to determine the worst case though.
Flycutting pistons is pretty common and much better than piston to valve contact.