Sneak Peek - Goblin V2

[Gtstorey]

I would be surprised if availability outside the NA factored into DF’s thinking. The numbers to other countries is going to very small.

 

[ah.b.normal]

I currently own a 2015 Dodge Grand Caravan with 3.6 Pentastar and 6 speed auto. My experience with it led me to state what I did above.

This whole Goblin1 path(With Penatstar drivetrain) adds an interesting twist. It could conceivably lengthen the Goblin1(1.2 or 1B?) production. With the new Goblin rear suspension and subframe, some of the major reasons to rely on a particular donor are gone. As a Machine Shop I'd bet DF would build you anything you want!, with a proper investment from you. They could be the sub-contractor and you could be the supplier! Yeah, that could work.

 

[LLBenJ]

Hmm. Less kit...in the kit car? Bought, not built? I had a horrible build experience so no doubt the preassembled car will help most builders but kind of defeats the purpose of "building" a kit car.

 

[Markm]

I just happened to take a break from tearing down on the donor for the wife goblin to read on this. I’m definitely biased towards the Gm powertrain due to my years at the dealership which is actually the biggest reason for our purchase. I figured at some point there would be a sunset on the cobalt platform since there’s much better out there. I just hope there will be many years of replacement parts for us that continue to run our V1 chassis and also look forward to the future of the Goblins.

 

[ah.b.normal]

I currently own a 2015 Dodge Grand Caravan with 3.6 Pentastar and 6 speed auto. My experience with it led me to state what I did above.

I guess my statements fell upon deaf ears. I was suggesting that if anyone wants to continue the G1 JUST buy the design rights or the company from DF and then you get to make ALL of the decisions!
There is way more to V2 than announcing the idea. The amount of research along with costs of trial and error must be staggering!! The time expenditure on dead ends alone has to be astounding! Plus dealing with the DOT type rules and paperwork! UUGH! Add to that you need to identify a suitable donor that you can adapt and was built in adequate numbers to support the kit. It appears to me the formula for a kit donor that reaches 500 sold would be somewhere in the range of 2-million donors built.
I am amazed that DF managed to get all of that done back in 2012? Regs And legal hassles have got to be worse today, they always are.
To have built V1 took a persistent genius, to build V2 could only mean that guy has a thick hide and a dreamers heart!
We are all are benefiting from his amazing achievement! And if you’re not amazed I think you are not paying attention.

 

[Monty23]

I am pretty excited about this V2 chassis. I was planning to put the 5-cylinder VW 07K engine with mid-size turbo of course (Group B rally car sounds do it for me) in a v1 goblin with a VW 02M 6-speed transmission, but this new chassis excites me even more. I wasn't a huge fan of the rear look of the V1 but the V2 looks much cleaner with the new aero and ducting. I am also happy to hear about the suspension enhancements since I plan to make this an autocross & track day car that is still streetable.

 

[LLBenJ]

Wow...these donors are a lot more expensive. I'll have to get on the sites and see what wrecked GTIs are running. I can't find anything under about $8k that's still on the road.

 

[snirtman]

Will the V2 windshield be retrofittable to the V1 chassis?

I was hoping @Lonny or @Adam could repond to this?

 

[ah.b.normal]

I just happened to take a break from tearing down on the donor for the wife goblin to read on this. I’m definitely biased towards the Gm powertrain due to my years at the dealership which is actually the biggest reason for our purchase. I figured at some point there would be a sunset on the cobalt platform since there’s much better out there. I just hope there will be many years of replacement parts for us that continue to run our V1 chassis and also look forward to the future of the Goblins.

Not jabbing at you but you mention there are “Much better platforms out there”. IYHO What might they be? Yes, name them for me. I am quite curious?
On my very different GOB-BALT journey I have interviewed many contestants but rejected each usually for lack of transplantable sub frame. (Former candidates: Dodge Avenger? 96?, Toyota Celica, buy another MR2ut of production and getting rare. Ion Redline coupe, plastic falling to bits here in the south. HHR:engine placement lost back seat. Cobalt. High production, inexpensive not completely butt ugly. (My Fall back position was Saturn Sky/Pontiac Solstice? Or the funky Solstice coupe?) BMW Z’s are just too expensive. JTR a 2000 up Jag coupe? Interesting but off topic.

Seriously. I am interested to hear other theories! Or Donors!! Thanks in Advance!

 

[ah.b.normal]

I was hoping @Lonny or @Adam could repond to this?

On a windshield side note: I saw a kit car, something like a goblin, ie: narrow, it used the windshield and remains of the frame from a SMART car or even the tiny Toyota/ Scion X/A? Narrow is the key and production glass is the joy! I think it even used their stock wiper system? I did the spotting!, you do the research and tell us all what you find out!

 

[LLBenJ]

Not jabbing at you but you mention there are “Much better platforms out there”. IYHO What might they be? Yes, name them for me. I am quite curious?
On my very different GOB-BALT journey I have interviewed many contestants but rejected each usually for lack of transplantable sub frame. (Former candidates: Dodge Avenger? 96?, Toyota Celica, buy another MR2ut of production and getting rare. Ion Redline coupe, plastic falling to bits here in the south. HHR:engine placement lost back seat. Cobalt. High production, inexpensive not completely butt ugly. (My Fall back position was Saturn Sky/Pontiac Solstice? Or the funky Solstice coupe?) BMW Z’s are just too expensive. JTR a 2000 up Jag coupe? Interesting but off topic.

Seriously. I am interested to hear other theories! Or Donors!! Thanks in Advance!

I think the build cost for your average V2 Goblin, coupled with the struggles seen on V1, may drive a conclusion that a different platform all together might have been a better option for V1. I'd much rather have a Honda powertrain in my Goblin. After breaking down import drivetrains with other projects, the Honda "oozes"...???...with quality compared to the GM powertrain. I realize this is hindsight, and DF's initial strategy was to reduce cost for the builds...I think...but why not choose a more universal, and far more supported platform, for V2? I'm seeing $8k VW GTIs with a lot of miles on the clock and the price goes north quickly unless you're looking at a junkyard find. I'm also going to go out on a limb and guess the entry into the V2 kit won't be $15k. So....we're looking at a $30K build? Maybe. I was chastised by a few builders here for doing that with my build and "scaring" other builders away. Fast forward to V2...and here we are. I, like you, am trying to figure out what we're getting into with the V2 other than an "improved builder experience" by preassembling most of the car for the customer.

 

[Ark :D]

I think the build cost for your average V2 Goblin, coupled with the struggles seen on V1, may drive a conclusion that a different platform all together might have been a better option for V1. I'd much rather have a Honda powertrain in my Goblin. After breaking down import drivetrains with other projects, the Honda "oozes"...???...with quality compared to the GM powertrain. I realize this is hindsight, and DF's initial strategy was to reduce cost for the builds...I think...but why not choose a more universal, and far more supported platform, for V2? I'm seeing $8k VW GTIs with a lot of miles on the clock and the price goes north quickly unless you're looking at a junkyard find. I'm also going to go out on a limb and guess the entry into the V2 kit won't be $15k. So....we're looking at a $30K build? Maybe. I was chastised by a few builders here for doing that with my build and "scaring" other builders away. Fast forward to V2...and here we are. I, like you, am trying to figure out what we're getting into with the V2 other than an "improved builder experience" by preassembling most of the car for the customer.

Respectfully.... this is just a sneak peek. DF themselves don't even have many answers yet. It may be best to wait for more information.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

I think the build cost for your average V2 Goblin, coupled with the struggles seen on V1, may drive a conclusion that a different platform all together might have been a better option for V1. I'd much rather have a Honda powertrain in my Goblin. After breaking down import drivetrains with other projects, the Honda "oozes"...???...with quality compared to the GM powertrain. I realize this is hindsight, and DF's initial strategy was to reduce cost for the builds...I think...but why not choose a more universal, and far more supported platform, for V2? I'm seeing $8k VW GTIs with a lot of miles on the clock and the price goes north quickly unless you're looking at a junkyard find. I'm also going to go out on a limb and guess the entry into the V2 kit won't be $15k. So....we're looking at a $30K build? Maybe. I was chastised by a few builders here for doing that with my build and "scaring" other builders away. Fast forward to V2...and here we are. I, like you, am trying to figure out what we're getting into with the V2 other than an "improved builder experience" by preassembling most of the car for the customer.

Are you going to build a Goblin V2? Did you get your pre-order in for one yet? Your responses and remarks continue to be highly negative toward everything about the Goblin. Ever think that your 'horrifying experience ' with your current Goblin is the reason why the Doyle's decided to make the Goblin V2 less 'challenging' to build because of the negative feedback from some builders? But in doing so the upfront cost of getting into the Goblin goes up - and with apparent source of viable Cobalts going down another popular platform had to be chosen.

VW was an excellent business choice because it can open up the Goblin to other markets, like Europe, Asia. There are lots of GTIs (and Golf's and Jettas) available in the US to build a TC, NA or even a diesel Goblin with the VW driveline choices. And there is also a large aftermarket for the VW. So sorry that your choice of donor for the Goblin V2 is not to your preference. But let us know when you have your pre-order in for one so the forum can again enjoy your negativity.

 

[Lonny]

This website shows the auction history through Copart and IAAI. I limited it to a final bid price under $3,000. There were 311 this year. Obviously, not all of these are usable donors (fire damage, flood damage, etc). I'm comfortable saying more than half are usable.

https://stat.vin/search-auto?sale_status=sold&vehicle_type=AUTOMOBILE&make=VOLKSWAGEN&model=GTI+(All+modifications)_group_id_6866&year_from=2015&year_to=2023&price_from=&price_to=3000&date_from=2023/01/01&date_to=2023/12/24&fuel=&drive=&odometer_start_miles=&odometer_end_miles=&highlights=&auction[]=1&auction[]=2

 

[Lonny]

What we looked for in a donor:
- Available from 2015-2020 (10 years newer than Cobalt)
- Turbocharged version needs to be widely available (as opposed to the Cobalt SS/TC being rare)
- Base horsepower over 200 horsepower. Preferably 2 liter or bigger.
- Easily tuned to at least 300 whp on pump gas with just a tune (no engine mods). With our Goblin exhaust being catless, all Goblins will be ready for a "Stage 2" tune, so it is a matter of buying a tune and flashing.
- Automatic transmission option (preferably not an old-school automatic and definitely not a CVT).
- Tuning and mod support from more than just one main vendor (as opposed to the Cobalt with ZZP)

 

[Ark :D]

Seems like a wise set of parameters, to me. I am hoping there's an option for an unbuilt kit, but time will tell.

 

[Lonny]

While designing Goblin V2, we kept in mind that we would be adding a second donor package in the near future.

We would appreciate the Goblin community's input for narrowing down an alternate donor.

Please include the following if you would like to suggest a possible donor and make it easy to compare apples to apples.

Make and model
Year available
Turbocharged (yes/no)
Base HP
Tuned HP on pump gas without internal mods
Auto trans option (yes/no)
Tuning and mod support (yes/no)

Lonny

 

[ah.b.normal]

Are you going to build a Goblin V2? Did you get your pre-order in for one yet? Your responses and remarks continue to be highly negative toward everything about the Goblin. Ever think that your 'horrifying experience ' with your current Goblin is the reason why the Doyle's decided to make the Goblin V2 less 'challenging' to build because of the negative feedback from some builders? But in doing so the upfront cost of getting into the Goblin goes up - and with apparent source of viable Cobalts going down another popular platform had to be chosen.

VW was an excellent business choice because it can open up the Goblin to other markets, like Europe, Asia. There are lots of GTIs (and Golf's and Jettas) available in the US to build a TC, NA or even a diesel Goblin with the VW driveline choices. And there is also a large aftermarket for the VW. So sorry that your choice of donor for the Goblin V2 is not to your preference. But let us know when you have your pre-order in for one so the forum can again enjoy your negativity.

LL. You may not be aware but DF originally powder coated their frames and then sent them. That had color match and damage problems that drove change. Like any biz they their exact biz model has evolved. Having not yet delved into the VW wiring systems my concern is that their systems would not be reducatble or reprogrammable? Wiring reprograming of any electrical system is a big problem. I don't envy anyone plumbing the depths of that system modification nightmare! The aftermarket is offering stand alone dashboards and Engine control systems unheard of just 5 years ago!

DS I'm asking you and others to please try and let the past go. Yeah, LL can be negative but if he can stay constructive I think we all benefit from his POV! I ain't even on the same track as the average Goblin builder and some might feel I don't have a dog in this fight. But I can listen to real constructive critique.(to my benefit.) There is so much brought up on this forum that is helping me along that I'm having trouble imagining doing my build without it! I was ready to sail into these uncarted waters on my build with just the tools and perspective I already possessed! Help is always welcome.

I believe that I have heard the "K" talk and the handwriting on the wall(to me) says, LL, put together YOUR group of like minded Goblin owners PLUS prospective buyers. With the new fully constructed Goblin subframe/rear suspension, propose a presold run of frames already modded with proper engine mounts and clearances to accept the Honda "K" motor and trans! (I think cooling and fueling systems will be adaptable from G1.)

I IMAGINE the main hurdle for DF to change G1 in any way is cost and longevity, a presold run could get DF through that barrier. Start writing your proposal!!, I'm sure they'll read it! I'm pretty sure that Doyle Fab will build nearly any project you can pay for! They took NASA's cash, I think they'll take yours.

What do you say Lonny??

 

[Lonny]

Make and model - VW GTI MK7 and MK7.5
Year available - 2015 thru 2021
Donors available for less than $3000
Turbocharged (yes/no) - Yes
Base HP - 228 for the 2020 year model
Tuned HP on pump gas without internal mods - 340 WHP (unconfirmed from website) https://eqtuning.com/collections/vw-audi-mqb-2-0t-mk7-8v/products/cobb-accessport-v3-dsg-vw-mqb-gti-r-gli-ea888-2-0tsi
Auto trans option (yes/no) - DSG Automatic (AWESOME!) 8 millisecond upshift times and rev match on downshifts.
Tuning and mod support (yes/no) - Yes https://mygolfmk7.com/2021/02/best-is20-stage-2-tune-options/

 

[Jason d]

Make and model - VW GTI MK7 and MK7.5
Year available - 2015 thru 2021
Donors available for less than $3000
Turbocharged (yes/no) - Yes
Base HP - 228 for the 2020 year model
Tuned HP on pump gas without internal mods - 340 WHP (unconfirmed from website) https://eqtuning.com/collections/vw-audi-mqb-2-0t-mk7-8v/products/cobb-accessport-v3-dsg-vw-mqb-gti-r-gli-ea888-2-0tsi
Auto trans option (yes/no) - DSG Automatic (AWESOME!) 8 millisecond upshift times and rev match on downshifts.
Tuning and mod support (yes/no) - Yes https://mygolfmk7.com/2021/02/best-is20-stage-2-tune-options/


View attachment 44566

Is the subframe tubular? Or you need to take off donor ?